Rep. Carlos González: Police Reform Bills Are 'The Beginning Of The Conversation' On Race Relations

Mass. Officials Voice Support For Protesters — Massachusetts State Rep. Russell Holmes, left, confers with Springfield State Rep. Carlos Gonzalez at a program voicing support for those protesting against police brutality against Black Americans in Boston on June 2, 2020. Elected officials of color in Massachusetts government marched from the African Meeting House on Joy Street to the nearby Massachusetts State House to hold a press conference in the wake of protests calling for justice for George Floyd.

Joe Mathieu, host of WGBH's Morning Edition

Joe Mathieu is the anchor and executive editor of WGBH's Morning Edition. Before joining WGBH Radio, Joe worked for six years as morning anchor on WBZ NewsRadio in Boston, where he was part of the team that received a Peabody Award for coverage of the Boston Marathon bombings. Joe also received the Edward R. Murrow Award for best newscast in a major market.

June 17, 2020

Updated August 07, 2023

As Chair of the Black and Latino Legislative Caucus, Representative Carlos Gonzáles of Sprinfield has played a pivotal role in working with state leaders to address police reform in the state, namely with a 10-point plan he helped unveil with the caucus earlier this month. WGBH Morning Edition host Joe Mathieu spoke with Rep. González to learn more about what's being proposed on Beacon Hill. The transcript below has been edited for clarity.

Joe Mathieu: A lot of people say it feels different this time [and] that real changes are really coming. Is that how you feel?

Rep. Carlos González: I strongly feel that the urgency is shared among all the parties that are involved. The outcry of the community [and] the protests have worked, and now the prayers need to be answered.

Mathieu: Well, let's talk about how to answer them. You have a broad framework ready in the House, I was just discussing while you were getting on the line, and I know that you've met with the Senate president as well as the governor. Is everyone on the same page, or are we about to have a grand debate?

González: We've met with the speaker of the House, the Senate president, and obviously the governor, as well as the unions, too. So we've brought everybody to the table and we've been addressing some of the main issues that are important to the cries that people have been hearing, not only because of Minneapolis, but throughout the country of America since the slave ships.

Mathieu: Some of the items in this bill are a bit different than some of the other versions. What are the priorities that you have? What must be in the legislation?

González: Well, I think we're looking at all the other versions out there, and we like the components of what we're hearing on one side of it, which is what the governor is going to present — some components — but we have to make sure that we understand that this is the beginning of the conversation on police reform and race relations.

Mathieu: I understand the governor, as soon as this week, will drop his POST Bills, what they call a "Peace Officer Standards in Training." This appears to be something that not only the governor backs, but lawmakers at large on Beacon Hill. Is this going to become reality?

González: Well, that is one point. POST is one point of the 10-point plan that the Black and Latino Caucus and elected officials of color throughout the state indicated during our press conference recently. POST is not the only item that needs to be resolved. Obviously POST brings a lot to the table and it's the beginning of the framework [for] police standards of training across Massachusetts and the ability to make sure that folks in the law enforcement arena can get certified and decertified. We have also [been] looking forward to include duty to intervene. We saw what happened in Minneapolis and we have a strong commitment from our speaker and our Senate president on banning chokeholds and the use of excessive force needs to be determined. How we address the excessive use of force must be part of the overall bill that's being worked out.

Mathieu: If all of that could happen, that would be considered major progress, right? A ban on chokeholds that you mentioned on top of the POST Bill that the governor is dropping and a requirement for officers to intervene. Would that not be considered pretty major advancement from a legislative standpoint?

González: From a legislator, but not from a community perspective. I think we still have work to do on addressing the root cause of poverty, the systematic racist policies that sustain people in what I call "Poverty Incorporated."

Mathieu: How do you bring that level of change beyond legislation? Is it simply having a conversation?

González: Well, you make sure that you are adequately funding education, that you are talking about home ownership and wealth development in the black and Latino communities — not only talking about affordable housing in low-income housing when you talk about housing associated to that community. We need to also make sure that we're part of the economic progress [and] that we have an opportunity for folks to start, grow [and] develop their businesses, and [for] governments [to] play a real role in addressing the needs of the black and Latino community, not only putting bandaids on some of the initiatives that we have seen throughout the time.

Mathieu: So when it comes to affordable housing and economic inequalities that you mention, will you prepare legislation to address those?

González: I think you will see different types of legislation that will talk about economic development. Simultaneously, or shortly thereafter to the police relations legislation, we will be addressing the affordable housing and low-income community, and how it impacts our communities of color. We need to rethink not only race relations and police conduct in America, we also need to rethink many of the root causes of keeping people in systems of poverty. How do we address that? We need to really rethink some of the economic opportunities that are out there, but somehow continue to miss the black and Latino community.