James Carter talks jazz, national politics, and saxophone mysteries

James Carter, a longtime saxophone innovator and collaborator with Wynton Marsalis, will be at Scullers Jazz Club in Boston on September 21. He talked with GBH Music’s Jazz on 89.7 hosts Al Davis and Va Lynda Robinson about his upcoming performances, his inspirations, and what political leaders can do to meaningfully support the arts.

Al Davis: James Carter, glad we could find some time on this beautiful day! You’re coming to Scullers on September 21st. Tell us about that. 

James Carter:  Great to talk to you! So, a recent project that I’ve put together is entitled “Looking at Lock,” the music of Eddie Lockjaw Davis. And back in '22, I took a pilgrimage out to Las Vegas on what would have been Jaws’s 100th birthday. I stayed there for about three days and hung out with the family. Up until that meeting, I thought Jaws was an only child, and it turns out that he had three brothers. There were a couple of handbills that were saved in a scrapbook where he and his brother were performing together. They had an exotic dancer, and Nipsey Russell was the emcee. It was trippy to see that on a flier for $1.50!

Al Davis: For those that don’t know, Eddie Lockjaw Davis was part of [Count] Basie’s band for many years.

James Carter: And even before that, he was one of the individuals that headed up Minton’s Playhouse in Harlem. So we’ll be doing a deep dive into a great cross-section of Jaws’s involvement in music. He’s at the cusp of bebop, but still swinging. And he was one of the progenitors of the tenor sax battle. Or has he would call it, “a study in contrast.”

Va Lynda Robinson: James, you played with Lester Bowie for a while. Tell me about that.

James Carter: Wow. The first time I saw Lester in concert was 1984, and The Art Ensemble played at the Detroit Institute of Arts. I was 15 years old at the time. And that was such a ritual to experience. Four years later, I was at the D.I.A. There was a creative music series and they brought Lester Bowie in for two or three days. I was brought in at the very last one, May 31st of '88. I had just acquired my very first bass saxophone, and I played with Lester for the first time that night.

I wore this red shark suit, and he kept saying, as he was introducing the cats in the band, “On bass saxophone... Santa Claus.”

I can’t begin to say how much he meant to me. He was my entry into New York. Before this I was playing with Wynton [Marsalis] and various other people, but I’d never come to New York as a musician until Lester brought me in in '88.

Al Davis: I’ve been wanting to ask you about your “Concerto for Saxophone.” Just an incredible performance. Can you tell us more about where that came from?

James Carter: Well it starts when my manager introduces me to the composer Roberto Sierra backstage sometime in 2000. And he says “I really dig your stuff, and I want to write a concerto for you!”

Al Davis: Hah! And you said, “Are you sure you want to do that?”

James Carter: And I say “Of course!”

Then... nothing. A year goes by and he calls me and we arrange a meet in Midtown. This is the winter of 2001. We meet and he starts showing me some orchestral sketches and some little excerpts and whatnot, and there’s quite a few that I dig. The meeting was no more than about an hour and some change, and he said, “All right, I look forward,” you know, “We’ll be in touch,” and I didn’t think anything else about it afterwards.

But about a month later, a big manila envelope is waiting for me downstairs. And I open it up and I see all of these notes that just ran across the page. It looked like somebody took some ink and just poured. And I thought, who the hell is playing this? Months go by and every few weeks I get another big manilla envelope, and movements start coming together. And it kind of has this cadence reminiscent of Vivaldi’s Four Seasons, you know. That kind of brought me back to my middle school days, and my band director there, Mr. Turner. Then I kind of fell in love with it.

Then when it came time for the premiere in October of 2002, it became less about a concerto for soprano and tenor saxophone, and more looking at it from a male and female perspective, and giving them voices and characterizations that would change on every performance of the piece. I’ve never kept anything the same.

Va Lynda Robinson: James, you have an extensive collection of instruments, and you even I understand you have an instrument owned by Don Byas. Is that true?

James Carter: Yes it is. And I’m very proud of my association with it and how it came about. I’ve got to give shout outs to National Public Radio and WDET in Detroit for introducing me to Don Byas! I used to tape this show called “Jazz Yesterday” on WDET. And one night in 1982, I taped a bit of what sounded a lot like Coleman Hawkins. I forgot to tape the intro to the piece, so I missed who it was, but I just loved the music.

Fast forward to 1992, I was at a music store called Sam’s Jams, and they had a two album set called “Don Byas, The Savoy Sessions,” with a picture of Byas playing a saxophone with a snake carved in it. And I was like, “Wow, $3.99, let me go ahead and get this, you know, just for the sake of the cover.”

That got me into him, but it wasn’t until I got to the next album, which started with “ How High the Moon.” I heard that infamous Jimmy Jones intro on piano, and I was like, “That’s the dude!” You’re collapsing ten years of listening in a second. So from that point on, I’ve been a fan of Byas.

So it’s a few years later and I’m a big enough fan that I’m working on a tribute for Don Byas’s centennial. And a guy writes into my label. And he’s very happy that somebody of my age group knows about Don Byas and realizes his worth.

And he says, “I happen to have a horn that has his name on it. Would you like to see it?”

And I’m thinking, “Oh, man, this cat’s jive!” Everybody knows that Don Byas’ horn is enshrined over at Rutgers University. But this guy sends me 26 attachments in his next email, and it’s a saxophone, sure enough, with Don Byas’s name carved into it. And I see the snake etched in the octave key. It’s the real thing!

To wrap this up, I get to go over to Paris and work out a deal to buy it. It turns out, this was his main horn that he used up until '62, and the Rutgers one is from the last ten years of his life. I use it whenever I play Byas’ tunes, which is a lot. 

Al Davis: So I’ve got a totally different question for you. We’re in this moment, politically, where so much popular music is part of politics. I saw Stevie Wonder at the DNC, and there’s all this talk about who Beyonce might endorse... and it got me thinking. Where is jazz in politics? Why aren’t these artists on stage?

James Carter: Well, you know, when you get into the point of talking about politics and popular culture, I think that people who book political events look at who has the most followers, and the most name recognition, and you get people like Stevie Wonder. 

Va Lynda Robinson: Yeah, that’s true!

James Carter: But, Kamala Harris did a little something for jazz. That press about her going record shopping was great, and she could’ve bought anything in there. But she came out with Charles Mingus! That was a nice little shout out. And I think that’s a good thing. Real substance would be pumping juice into the National Endowment for the Arts and making jazz more of a national conversation again.

Al Davis: Let’s hope the conversation keeps going! James Carter, thank you! Have a great show.

James Carter: Thanks Al, I’ll see you soon, thanks Va Lynda!